Moloth - The M-Forums

OK, before I go see it, read this article...

http://moviesblog.mtv.com/2008/07/07/do … oker-ever/

... and know that I agree with it 100%.  Will I be happy with Ledger's Joker? Or do you think it will annoy me?

Also, is your topic intentionally misspelled?

Ok junior birdmen, Ben and I just saw it, and now you're gonna have to listen to what I have to say.

I didn't like it. I'll get to why in just a moment. First, lets start with what I did like.

The skyhook extraction. It was totally a Batman moment.

Lucius Fox. yeah its Morgan Freeman starring as Morgan Freeman, but it works. That's what Fox is like.

Two-face. First time I have EVER like Harvey Dent/Two-face. They actually made Dent a likable character, and Two-faces makeup/cgi worked perfectly. His motivations were interesting and the coin seemed less stupid than it usually does.

Gordon. Gary Oldman fucking owns Jim Gordan. Watching his performance is like seeing the Gordon from the comics walking around in real life. I would watch an entire movie centered just on Gordon.

And that's it for what I liked, now on to the suck.

The Batpod. Fakey and ridiculous looking. Reeks of "We Need a New Vehicle for the movie so just make up something that we can sell toys of." That scene where it does a 180 on a wheelie made me roll my eyes.

Sonar cell phones. What the fuck is this shit? Magic? I'd expect pseudotech liek this from James Bond, not from this supposedly "realistic" take on Batman. The special effects for it looked like it was stolen from Daredevil. Oh and, seeing batmans eyes flash and flicker blue? Completely necessary and stupid looking. Why on earth would he try and fight with that shit on?

Fight Scenes. Largely incomprehensible. Fist fights area blur of shadows and quick camera cuts. The final battle was the biggest culprit of this.

Gotham. In the first movie, they made Chicago look like Gotham with clever lighting and angled shots. In this movie Gotham looks exactly like Chicago. I kept expecting the tumbler to drive past Wrigley Field. Hell, Wayne's lambo even had an Illinois license plate.

Batman. Christian Bale is a bad actor. Wanna know why? Cause he doesnt act. He just reads all his lines in the same monotone voice. There was not one moment in the movie when he emoted like a human being. He either talked quietly or shouted in that ridiculous Jack Donaghy voice. At the end of the movie, during the Two-face face off, i burst into laughter in the middle of the scene. Dent and Batman were duking it out by having a talking like this contest. The new mask is also horrible. the nose on it is distractingly large, and it makes his cheeks look reallly fat.

Joker. Ledger was not impressive. I never got the feeling that I was looking at the Joker, just Heath acting like he was Chaotic Evil. He doesnt deserve an Oscar for a performance that is not exceptional. Secondly, his plots were dull. There was nothing he did that caught me off guard. He telegraphed the punchline to every killing beforehand. Lame.

Excitement. Or lack thereof. I was bored with the movie from about the halfway part. I just wanted it to end.

So there you have it. You don't have to agree with me, but i just want you all to know that not everyone holds this movie up on a pedestal.

Now Nolan needs to give me my $9.00 back.

Out of all I said, thats all you got from this?

FUCK YOU.

Exactly. I listed specific reasons why I didn't like the movie, and you come back with "you just didnt like it cause everyone else did." I find that insulting, and I thought you had more respect for me than that.

The difference is I like Transformers for what it is - a deeply flawed movie about toys that are neat. TDK on the other hand is being hailed as best movie ever made, best comic movie ever made, and worthy of Oscars. The only thing Transformers is worthy of Oscar wise is POSSIBLY special effects (which it lost to talking polar bears). I can like flawed movies, but I damn sure recognize the flaws when I see them. In the case of TDK, the flaws outnumbered the things I really enjoyed in the movie, which lead to me feeling unsatisfied with it as a whole.

And yes I took your remark about my opinion as a slam against me because you directly implied that I was shallow enough to base my opinion on something solely based on what other people think about it. I'm not Jasoning my stance on TDK.

Maybe I'm being to picky about some things. Ledger does a good job of creating a solid performance, even if it isnt the Joker I want to see. The batpod, cellphone, and costume quibbles are a little pithy, but they bugged me while watching. However, I still think that Nolan does not know how to film action scenes. It was nigh-impossible for me to follow what was going on spatially in the tunnel chase and final battle scenes. I feel that Bale did a better job as Bats in the first movie. The gravel in his voice in TDK is just too over the top for me.

I did not walk into the theater wanting to hate this movie. I had my fears that I wasn't going to like it, but I was going to give it a fair shake because deep down I wanted it to be good.

Maybe my post was worded a little too aggressively, but the movie was very disappointing for me and I wanted to convey my displeasure. I apologize if anyone felt as if I was attacking them for liking it.

I would LOVE for you, or anyone else, to reasonably debate my complaints point by point. I enjoy debating about movies the same way you enjoy debating about religion and philosophy. Conflicting opinions often lead to greater understanding.

Last edited by TwoHands (7/26/08 11:53 am)

A valid concern. There have been times that I have been overly kind to movies hated by the masses. Speed Racer and Sky Captain were hated by most people but I think that they're the bees knees. At the moment, I cannot think of any movies (other than TDK) where the reverse was true, but I don't doubt that there are some.

But let me quote myself:

I did not walk into the theater wanting to hate this movie. I had my fears that I wasn't going to like it, but I was going to give it a fair shake because deep down I wanted it to be good.

If I were Jasoning my position, I would have flat out decided that the movie was bad simply because it was popular. That isn't how I arrived at my conclusions. The reasons I didnt enjoy TDK are all spelled out above. Some are simply personal opinion, some are objective criticism.

The movie isnt awful. It isnt Batman and Robin, it isn't even Batman Forever. But after the superbly crafted Batman Begins, it just seemed like such a step down to me.

Please do! I want to discuss the movie honestly and energetically.

Bale's Batman voice was definitely worse than the one he used in the first movie. It's low and raspy to the point where it almost sounds like a parody of what he did in the first movie. But more aggrivating is that he seems to lose any kind of tonal inflection when he uses it. His voice is threatening certainly, but it carries little emotion outside of that. Batman is a serious dude but he should still emote some.

Regardless of what anyone thought of the movie, the dvd is out now, and by most accounts it sucks.

Here is everything offered across two discs.

-Short documentary on Hans Zimmer making the music (which amounted to how many annoying sounds they could compile to make the "sound" of the Joker)
- Short documentary on the new costume, and the Bat-Pod (most of which was a clip show "voice of_(enter name here)")
- A series of news broadcasts from Gotham (which considering the depth and complexity of the movie, are SEVERELY under-acted and cheap looking)
- The 6 Imax sequences in the highest res possible for a DVD.
- Digital Copy

No commentary, no deleted scenes, no actor interviews, no behind the scenes documentaries, no tribute to Ledger.

Ten bucks says they'll put out the real special edition sometime before part 3 comes out.

No friggin way.  Whoever did that has some balls.

I retract my statement, then.  >_>

seriously.