Moloth - The M-Forums

Sparks wrote:

But what if I agree with it?

Then don't.  I'm sure you're not the only one

My 1st comment just flame bait but in all honesty I do think their needs to be tighter limits on abortion.  Many women have too cavalier an approach to it.

Men need to man up and be safer about it and Women need to be more proactive and less retroactive.

Actions have Repercussions

People I work with wive's, former classmates, and Friends girlfriends

Sparks wrote:

My 1st comment just flame bait

we know. Cin has more grace than to fall for it.

Sparks wrote:

but in all honesty I do think their needs to be tighter limits on abortion.

so, you think there needs to be tighter limits on something that has no effect on you or your life and only effects a subset of society that you happen to not be. Its easy to make rules for OTHER people, huh?

Sparks wrote:

Many women have too cavalier an approach to it.

this is an opinion, not a fact.
An opinion, i might add, that has nothing supporting it... no first hand experience and no objective measurement. It is merely a broad, accusatory and unsubstantiated statement.

Sparks wrote:

Men need to man up and be safer about it and Women need to be more proactive and less retroactive.

This could be true about great many things in life. simply saying "people need to be better" is hardly insightful or useful.

Sparks wrote:

Actions have Repercussions

Yes, like having to get an abortion for an unwanted fetus. That is a possible repercussion.

..or the repercussions of stating your opinion on the internet where other people can comment on it.

MizPhoenix wrote:

until it has a heart and functioning brain it's a tumor, ie mass of tissue/cells

Hmm.. that might not be the best delimiter of tumor-ness...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prenatal_development

i think medically and legally, that week 10 is the milestone that most consider the difference between a 'lump of cells' and a viable fetus.

that said... around the 25th week is when the fetus even has a real shot at being viable outside the womb. Some might consider that the fetus becomes a 'baby' at around this time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Prena … _table.svg


it is my personal opinion (that happens to mirror Roe v. Wade) that the further along in the pregnancy the fetus is, the more consideration it deserves, as far as abortion is concerned. In other words, i have very little problem with an abortion performed in the 1st trimester, i think consideration should be used in the 2nd trimester and one should have a very good reason for requesting/performing an abortion with a 3rd trimester fetus.

That said, that is all merely my opinion and i do not, nor would i, impose it on a woman in that situation.

Life is not digital... it is not either there or not there. it is an unbroken line of life, from child to mother/father/progenitor going back about 3.5 billion years to self-replicating amino acids. the question of 'when does life begin?' is a fallacious one. We shed, destroy, kill, expunge and waste living cells all the time. Hell, considering the capacity of stem cell technology, any ONE of our cells has the potential to become a person.

The question should be "when does an abortion cause an unacceptable amount of suffering?".

because i base my morality on the concept that suffering is bad, i gauge the amount of immorality of an action based on how much suffering it causes. Therefore, the more capacity something has for suffering, the more consideration it deserves, morally.
I'll hit a rock. it is amoral.
i'll kill/eat a chicken. the amount of suffering it feels is not over my threshold of concern... i gain more than it loses.
I'll not torture a human child or adult. There is no conceivable gain that would offset the amount of suffering that would cause.

A zygote is incapable of suffering. it is not aware, a person or anything more than a clump of cells that have the potential of becoming an adult human being. A fetus has a human-like form and structure, both internal and external. A prenatal baby can react to stimuli.. be it sound, touch or even pain. A newborn is even more 'deserving' of consideration because it is a stand alone entity, however weak and dependent. ...the scale continues to a fully aware and sentient person.

Hey Sparksie, I really would like to find out your answers to my questions above.  I'm not out to "spank" you or anything (unless of course you're into that kind of thing).  I'm just curious as to how you came about your conclusions.

Ahfuck gahdammit.